Program updates the Pack Info incorrectly

[Greg the Yeti]

Since writing the last post it occured to me that the possibility of having the number of Cards in the Pack displayed might actually be a useful and desirable function if people are using "Gather to a New Deck". Each of the two resulting Packs showing clearly how many cards they contain. Also useful, to be sure that the Pack has returned to "Normal" after closing the second Pack.

It would certainly be a function which I would probably leave "on" just for that. So perhaps it wouldn' be just a De-Bugging Tool after all.

Regards Greg the Yeti

[Greg the Yeti]

Hi Richard,
I've been continuing normal use and doing a few extra tests as I think of them.

I've had none of the erratic fault "erratic changes to the number of cards", so it's looking like that is due to the number of available Decks. however:-

The other fault I mentioned above regarding the new "Gather to a New Deck" fault seems entirely un-connected with that and is not in the least erratic. It does it every time.

Let me run through that again just for clarity.

I used a Lottery Deck again as a Guinea Pig. It should have 50 cards.

I) I checked the number of cards before starting - 50 there.
2) (F4 for Free Selection mode:-) I selected and drew the first nine cards 1 through to 9.
3) I selected "Gather to a New Deck" and that worked as it should. 9 cards in the new Deck, 41 cards in the "Main" Deck.
4) Having confirmed the two Decks numbers I went straight ahead and closed the New Deck.
5) As far as I understand it at this point I expect the "Main" Deck to return to 50 cards. ie the 9 removed cards go back into the Pack? That seems to be the only thing that makes sense here.
6) There were still just 41 cards in that Deck.
7) So I tried all the same methods to "Return the Deck to Default" plus one other I thought of.
a) Went to the Previous Deck and back, a trick that often works on errant Decks.
b) Re-Selected the same Deck from the Deck Menu
c) Selected another Deck and then Re-Selected the Lottery Deck.
d) Closed and re-opened Orphalese.
e) Finally I had to go into Deck Options to manually change the number of Cards. They sprang back instantly to the correct 50!
EDIT:- thought of another method to try f) Select "Refresh" under "My Decks". I will try that next time and report back, but I'm not hopeful that that will work either.
EDIT2:- Checked that - it didn't work...

I'd say this was a genuine fault and happens every time I try it. It's clearly not connected with the other problem so it does need looking into. (Especially as I really like the new "Gather to a New Deck!)

Regards
Greg theYeti

Would you prefer this in a new thread? Feel free to move it. Subject "Gather to a New Deck Fault"?

[Greg the Yeti]

For that last Check I merely visually checked the cards present in "Free Selection Mode", the cards weren't there. However on loggin out of the Forum and checking the Deck Options, it said 50 cards. More Bizarre!

I went back to Free Selection mode and checked again. No the cards aren't there! Only the 41.

I thought to try the check a) above. I went back to the previous Deck and back up again. This time, having done a full "Refresh" of the Deck Menu first, it worked.

But I shouldn't have to do a full refresh of the Deck Menu each time I stop using a "Gathered to a New Deck" Pack.

I hope this helps.

Regards
Greg the Yeti

[Greg the Yeti]

I should mention that I am using what I believe to be the most recent version 9.4.1.7.

I've tested out the fault on another Deck. This time I used the "Lunatic" Tarot. As might happen in a real case, I extracted the entire Major Arcana to the New Deck. All that worked fine. On closing the New Deck those cards were not returned to the Main Deck, just as happens with the Lottery Deck "EuroMillions Chiller Parchment Edition" my previous Guinea Pig.

Since I've found that a full "Refresh" of the Deck Menu works against the "Gather to a New Deck Fault" I suggest that Orphalese has the capability to sort it, already there. All that is required is:-

For the Program to do a local "1 Deck Refresh", followed by Re-Selection of the Deck.

That should work, however I think a more consistent approach would be to get the Gather to a New Deck to automatically return the Cards to the Main Deck on exit from the function. To put everything "As it was before" the Gather to a New Deck.

Regards
Greg the Yeti

[Programmer]

I really don't understand the problem here. If you want to refresh the deck so all the cards are back in it you just choose that deck again from the decks menu. I have tested it just now and it works fine. Simply by reselecting the deck you are doing the refresh you want.

[Greg the Yeti]

Ooops!

It looks like this fault IS connected to the number of Available Decks...

I was doing some of the tests mentioned with about 420 Decks, before completing the Removal of un-necessary Decks. The "Erratic" Fault seemed to be gone by then, so my comments and tests were all in good faith.

Now that I have got my Available Decks down to 280 (and the maximum set at 300) I have just done the Gather and then Closed the Gathered Deck -three times. It worked as you say. Reselecting the Deck from the Deck Menu does now Refresh the Deck. It didn't before as I had noted.

HOWEVER: - I still think it is reasonable to expect that when the extra Deck is closed the Cards are Automatically returned by the Program to their "Master" Deck.

Regards
Greg the Yeti

[Programmer]

Ok, thanks for the feedback, it sounds like it not something that is easily repeated without an unfeasibly large deck collection. Regarding returning the cards to the bottom of the deck, I can see it makes sense in a way but on the other hand I can imagine other people might use it as a way of temporarily creating a reduced deck (i.e. meaning the main deck) which they then continue to use, and it that case they might want to close the other one to reduce screen clutter.

[Greg the Yeti]

Yes there are various ways to use "Gather to a New Deck".
1) The Reduced "Main" Deck - as you say.
2) The Extracted Cards on their own.
3) With some Decks, possibly even BOTH might be used? A reading with Different Suits for separate areas and perhaps the Major Arcana as well...

To prioritize one of those uses so that their "Extra Convenience" takes away from "Necessary Function" for everybody else seems very unwise. I suggest not letting that group get used to forcing that bad function on everyone!

When you close the Extra Deck you really shouldn't have to do EXTRA THINGS to get the Deck Back to Normal!! That is annoying, messy and doesn't feel up to Orphalese's normal standard of good operation!

If people don't want clutter on the Desktop with the Extra Deck, the program already has the "Deck Park".

If they want to use the Main Deck but have that "Parked", then a more logical and equitable solution would be to allow an extended Deck Park. If that's what they want to do, then they could use a separate command on the Extra Deck "Park this Deck" - the Deck Park would double in size to accomodate the Extra Deck.

Then nobody would have to do an annoying Extra Task of Re-selecting the Deck.

Regards
Greg the Yeti

Edit:-
Another way of resolving this while satisfying both groups of users, would be as follows:
To add an extra Menu Item to the "Gather Group" - "Gather and Remove". This is what those people want to do, and the functionality is really already there, it would only require an extra stage in whatever script is already used by "Gather to a New Deck" - of closing the created Deck automatically. This is what they want so give them this. I think they might even like that better?...

Then give "Gather to a New Deck" the logical and user friendly action, of the Deck going back to normal when the Extra Deck is closed.

This should increase happiness of all users of the function and be the easiest to implement?

Regards
Greg the Yeti

[Programmer]

OK, I've included it in the new list in the new topic I posted for suggestions for future development.

[Greg the Yeti]

Regretably I have to report that the "Erratic" fault where Orphalese wrongly changes the number of cards in a Deck, often taking the number from one Deck and applying it to another is continuing.

I have noticed it twice now in the last week. The first time it happened was the first time I had used the Deck since I had reduced my number of available Decks to below 300, so I thought it might have happened back then, and I'd only just noticed it. This time, it was the second time I'd used it and so it cannot have been an "old fault I'd only just noticed".

Just in case it helps a little detail:-

I was using a EuroMillions Deck and a EuroMillions Stars Deck to choose a ticket. I opened them using a saved Collection.

When I used the New Random Deck with the EuroMillions Deck the Random Deck Dialogue Popped up requiring Mouse movements. When I pressed the "New Random Deck" button at the bottom it complained saying something like "Do the Draw" - but I was at the stage of wanting to see the Random Deck Applied. (You usually see a small "shuffle like" sequence, which had not yet happened).

I closed that, since I couldn't get it to do the "New Random Deck" I used a regular "Seeded Shuffle" instead.

I did the Spread for that Deck and then noted them and moved to the EuroMillions Stars Deck.

I tried the "New Random Deck" here as well. This time an error message, saying something like it couldn't find the right "resource" - it didn't say card but it made me think that it might be "the fault" again so...

At that point I checked the Deck and indeed, although it only has 11 cards it was showing at 50 (the number of the previous EuroMillions Deck).

Orphalese 9.4.1.8
Windows 7
Available Decks 272 (with maximum set at 300 as per standard).

Sorry - it's not sorted yet!

Regards
Greg the Yeti